Default settings for Boomerang III user...or RC-50

edited February 2013 in General

Here's an idea... For those people familiar with looping on a Boomerang III or Roland RC-50, it might really help them immediately feel at home with Loopy if there was a default setup option to assign MIDI control actions with an external controller that would emulate the foot buttons they are used to.

For example, if button 1 on a Boomerang III or RC-50 has one function when you tap it and another when you press and hold it, then it'd be nice if you could go into Loopy and say "map button 1 off my external controller to do the functions of the Rang III"....etc.

That way out get instant satisfaction and gratification with Loopy from seasoned loopers. And if Loopy is not able to match those functions, then there's your list if features to be enhanced to be added to our "to be developed" list ;-)

Comments

  • That's a really great idea. Go vote for 'export midi config'! Users could make and share them.

  • Loopy cannot perform all the functions of the Boomerang (as yet), as far as I can tell.
    I understand the logic of using the tap/press hold, but as far as I know there is no ability to move seamlessly from recording verse > into recording chorus > into recording bridge(s) with one button press,as you can on Boomerang. (I'm looping this feature request.)

    When that functionality arrives, I'll buy an iPad and Loopy and leave the 'Rang home.

  • In the spirit of educating me: How does the Rang present the verse/chorus/bridge track grouping functionality? Could you walk me through the process of recording the three sections, selecting which loops go in which, then stepping through?

  • edited February 2013

    Hi Michael,

    I have been working with the Boomerang1 and the Boomerang +. These offer two loops. The Boomerang 3 offers up to four. I haven't bought it yet because I'm holding out hope someone provides this functionality with a reliable midi-clock sync. Boomerang does not.
    I'll let "VARIOUS ARTIST" fill you in on anything about the ' Rang3 that he thinks might interest you, or be desirable to include.

    When setting up verse and chorus on the earlier model, it is as simple as stepping on the record button> playing until the end of verse > then stepping on the A/B button which immediately stops recording of verse ( loop 1) and starts the recording of chorus ( loop2 ). You have the option then of stepping again on A/B which will play back loop1, or stepping on record again which will play back loop 2. They can be of different lengths - not tied to a multiple of the first loop.This is a seamless transition.There are various ways to call up a specific loop after they are recorded,but I won't go into detail here.
    The 'Rang 3 allows for two extra loops that could be used as bridge(s). It can work in the same manner as above with loops 3 and 4. It also has several other options not available on the original ' Rang.

    Let me add this from the manual. It repeats some of the above, but might be clearer as to the multi-function of the A/B button.

    A/B mode for the "once" button:
    "Selecting this mode provides you with two loops, say for a verse and a chorus. We call the main loop “A”, and “B” is the secondary loop.
    While recording A, A/B concludes recording of A and immediately starts recording B, and loop ‘b’ turns on. While recording B, A/B concludes recording of B and immediately starts playback of A, and loop ‘b’ turns off.
    If both loops have been recorded, then A/B behaves like this. With loop A playing, A/B causes loop ‘b’ to blink; at the end of loop A, a smooth transition to B will occur, and loop ‘b’ turns on solidly. If loop B is playing, A/Bcauses loop ‘b’ to blink; at the end of loop B, a smooth transition to A will occur, and loop ‘b’ turns off. If no loop is
    playing, A/B chooses which loop to work with. A is selected if loop ‘b’ is off; B is selected if loop ‘b’ is on.

    A/B1 mode:
    This mode is the same as A/B with one exception. With loop A playing, A/B causes loop B to play once and then return to loop A "

    (The "modes" above are programmable thru a specific button press process.)

    Here, also, is a link to a good picture of the Boomerang +. It gives you an idea of the layout of buttons.:
    http://cachepe.zzounds.com/media/quality,85/booboo-3-bf9baa18a5526eed921fbdaaf9c59451.jpg

    The ability to record parts in this manner is an essential, IMHO, for a looping device.
    The ability to sync to external clock makes the possibilities much greater.

    I hope this is helpful. Thanks for your consideration.

    Respect, Otis

  • Lovely, thank you Otis! This is great info. I quite like the idea of putting together features that mimic existing loop pedals, accessible via MIDI, so you can use the same techniques you're used to.

  • Great job Otis, I don't think there's much I need to add to that for the Boomerang. Maybe someone who's more familiar with the Roland pedals can chime in here too. I honestly think you can win over a ton of people who lean towards a trusted hardware unit when they see an easy path to becoming immediately productive with Loopy by simply using it as they have grown accustomed to.

    Cheers
    Peter

  • edited February 2013

    Hi Michael,

    Glad that was worth your time.

    This might interest you as well:
    http://www.keithmcmillen.com/softstep/overview

    This pedal has usb out.
    It's made by Keith McMillen Industries in Berkeley Ca. ( local to you?)

    Although I'm not totally happy with the fact that some of the functionality promised doesn't seem to work in the real world ( several types of simultaneous midi manipulation per pad, but difficult to actually manipulate ), it can work in "stand alone mode" quite fine for basic commands,volume control , Etc... It has already been proven to communicate with iOS devices easily.

    Caveat emptor (buyer beware): mine is pretty much sitting in a drawer waiting for the right match up. I'm not trying to sell these to anyone( no affiliation), just hoping a fire gets lit under the abilities it promises. If anyone does check it out though, tell them Otis Scarecroe sent you.(had to do it, sorry)

    I think it would behoove Keith McMillen to offer you a free one to play with/ program for Loopy2. It could only improve his sales, and I have the feeling YOU could make it behave very well with Loopy. ( I can't promise anything for Keith... just saying.) I don't know what you are using for a foot controller, but think this would be worth a look.

    Maybe you two might convene on possibilities of a mating of your products. If he hasn't already tried Softstep with Loopy, he's slacking!!
    Sometimes the sum is greater than the parts.

    Looking forward to seeing where you're taking Loopy. I hope your interest in the 'Rang means you are moving towards the seamless verse,chorus, bridge concept. I'll be on board immediately if so.

    I'm sorry if bringing this up is out of line on the forum, but........

    Respect, Otis

  • Cheers Otis =) I'm aware of the Softstep, just haven't really taken any specific action.

    A few folks have asked about MIDI binding presets, which I'm thinking would be a pretty good idea. That way, I could ultimately build in default per-device presets.

    Check out the new MIDI action - toggle record, mute, select next track - for a baby step towards this sort of thing.

  • I'm a live performer who uses a Boomerang III for looping. I am also testing using Loopy for live performance via a SoftStep pedal and a Line6 HD500 (which I use live to control numerous devices as well as guitar fx). The Boomerang III was a big advance over earlier Boomerang models, as it allows the user to customize functionality, and playing modes.

    The Rang III has three primary loops. There are dedicated foot-switches for Loop 1, Loop 2, and Loop 3, along with two Bonus switches (a green one and a yellow one, with corresponding LED colors). These Bonus buttons can be assigned to various functions, including Stack (overdub), Erase, (play) Once, Octave (half-speed), Reverse, Play-Stop All, Fade, Undo, Copy, Reverse Solo, and Loop 4. The Bonus foot-switches operate at TWO level (Tap and Press) effectively resulting in four foot-switches.

    Knobs are provided to assign functions to Bonus 1 Tap, Bonus 1 Press, Bonus 2 Tap, and Bonus 2 Press. So…. you can customize the Rang III for your performance needs, while minimizing the amount of buttons required (and thinking during live performance).

    The Rang III offers four operating modes or “Play Styles”: Serial, Serial-Sync, Sync, and Free. When set to Serial, loops play one at a time, which allows you to create individual loops for each part of a song (verse, chorus, bridge, etc.), and switch between them. For example, if Loop 1 has been recorded and is playing, pressing the Loop 2 foot-switch cues Loop 2 up for recording, and as soon as Loop 1 completes its cycle, it is muted and recording begins on Loop 2. There’s no need to press more than one foot-switch, or to “punch in” accurately—everything is automated. Serial- Sync is similar, except that Loop 3 becomes the “master” loop, the other loops are synchronized to it, and Loop 3 can continue playing at the same time as any one of the other loops. Sync is a variation on Serial-Sync, which allows all loops to play together, synchronized to Loop 3. Free allows all loops to play together independently.

    I always perform using Serial-Sync. I'll typically record a "master" Loop 3, and either use it immediately or save it for playing later in a song. Loop 2 I will use as a "slave loop", usually 2X or 3X the length of Loop 3. I can then stop or start either loop independently or together, and they are always and sync, and start playing from the start. I have my Bonus buttons programmed to allow Stack (overdubs), Stop/Start all, Erase, and Fade.

  • Thanks for this @soundog!

  • Not quite in the same league but here's how the Akai Headrush (original) works:

    • Right button tap to record
    • Left button tap to end recording and start looping
    • Left button tap to stop/start the loop
    • Right button tap to overdub
    • Left again to stop overdubbing and let the loop continue

    The cool feature: if you enter overdub mode (right button) and tap the right button again you can clear all of the overdubs but keep your original loop and start overdubbing again. I could see this happen in loopy by adding a new loop every time you enter overdub mode. Tapping the right button again would mute all of the loops except the first. Perhaps hitting it again could go so far as to actually clearing them.

  • Its interesting to read about how different hardware loopers are set up (or can be customized). It would seem that, if Loopy had a wide enough selection of available bindings (and I know thats a LOT of work), it would be possible to provide presets that mimic different hardware pedals, especially when using it with hardware footswitchs.

  • I get why people want to emulate to feel comfortable and all, but for me Loopy is about creating new possibilities and hoping to push the boundaries of live looping. I do think this is an excellent idea to have this available for people to get used to what they have already learned and eventually branch out.

    I literally check every day to see if an update is out. When I see there is an update, it's like Christmas all over again because its like gaining a new pedal for free!

  • Can you imagine the market if he successfully emulates every looper out there for a fraction of the price? They might actually have make the live looper reasonably priced.

  • I agree with the notion of "new possibilities" and I think Loopy already has that down and will continue to extend that way. However the are existing features in other (hardware) loopers that have made adjustments to accommodate the live looper and it's worth examining these to see if there are shortfalls in Loopy's feature set.

    I think Loopy is excellent, and indeed I choose it over the hardware loopers, but there are some of these features or ease-of-use in a live situation that I think are worth considering. Here's a product link for the Rang III with all the features listed, but check out the video which really showcase it very well:

    Rang III: http://www.boomerangmusic.com/E156.shtml

    Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uj2Xt_-wSdc

  • @variousartist: nice selection of footwear and hats in that video (worn by the Boomerang's creator and developer)!

    One great thing about the Boomerang III (and Loopy) is providing the user with the ability to customize the looper. Live performers (or living room loopers) have different needs and playing styles, so being able to customize how a looper reacts to buttons is a huge asset.

  • Agree with loopy being about new possibilities for sure. I think this idea is great not so much for learning good ideas from existing loopers (that's good too!) but to make starting with loopy a seamless experience for new users coming from existing loopers.

  • the boomerang iii is a great looper; if there wouldnt be loopy, I would have bought that one...
    but beside it is expensive, the worst thing is, that is does not save anything!
    Gig is over, unpluggin the stuff -all gone with The Rang III

  • The Boomerang III IS a great looper; I'll sing its praises high and low. I've tried just about all of them. Its designed by guitarists for extreme performance looping, but I use mine for guitar, sax, and vocals. The sound is pristine, it has stereo in and out (or two mono), perfect timing, quiet buttons, compact, great support. And, as mentioned, the buttons are customizable so you can set it up to match how you perform.

    I personally don't care if it doesn't save; I don't use any pre-recorded tracks or loops when I perform, and if I want to save anything I just record my gig! When Loopy is a complete replacement for me, I may make the switch. But for now I am a Rang-Head.

  • Just to chime in. I thought I saw someone say that the Boomerang III does not have MIDI clock sync, which it does. I've been using it to sync with the clock coming from Ableton Live and it links up to it very easily without any problems. I've also synced it with a Dave Smith Mopho without a problem.

    I love the pedal but just wish there was an option for instant stacking over a loop (similar to looping with a Line 6) as opposed to having to press the stack button after creating the loop and then pressing that loop's button again. I assume there is no solution to this problem?

  • edited August 2014

    I just borrowed a 'Rang3 from a friend. The two button hits into stack surprises me.
    I've been using the Boomerang and then Boomerang+ ( upgrade ), and it's always been possible to hit the stack button to end recording on a loop and go into immediate overdub on that loop. (the stack button can be programmed to be latching or
    momentary > momentary allows fixing holes, weakly played chords, etc. as you would with a recorder's dub button. )

    Rick, there is this from section 10.1 in 'Rang 3 manual:

    "Stacking immediately after recording. Sometimes it’s cool to record a loop and have stacking active immediately when the loop plays. Tap Loop 2 to begin recording Loop 2. Then press Stack and Stack blinks slow. Now tap Loop 2 a second time to conclude recording and play your new loop. When the loop plays stacking will be active."

    You said: "as opposed to having to press the stack button after creating the loop and then pressing that loop's button again." In reality, you can hit the stack button WHILE you are creating the loop, as described above.

    I will give Mike at Boomerang a call and see if he can add the ability to go directly into stack without that extra tap. He is very helpful and flexible when it comes to his product, and always open to suggestions. When he was designing the Rang 3 he spent well over an hour on the phone with me picking my brain for ways to improve performance. Maybe there's an easy work around.

    I am happy to hear that you are satisfied with the sync to midi clock( some folks claim it drifts ). I strongly suggested that ability when we talked, and he offered a free upgrade to allow this shortly after he introduced the Rang 3.

    Loop onward,

    Otis

  • edited January 2015

    Newer features for the Boomerang 3 have been added!
    I finally bought one when they got the midi clock feature completed.

    Rick Parker, they have improved the midi clock function considerably in the newest version of software. Great leaps at Boomerang!

    Also added is a feature that allows you to hold the record button of a loop when starting recording for a second , which automatically sets it up for stacking at end of loop recording. A lot better than what we had before.

    Decay can now be assigned to the expression pedal input ( think that's fairly new as well) You have to choose between volume and decay for expression pedal

    i Strongly suggest downloading the latest firmware. Make sure you follow the download instructions to the letter ( the disclaimer/warning on download page is a bit daunting, but everything worked just fine for me)

    I'm a happy looper with this thing now. I have a request in for independent decay rates per loop. That and midi command reception will make it nearly perfect. Please contact Mike at Boomerang and make requests " 'Rang" users. He responds to multiple squeaky wheels!

    Respect, Otis

  • Otises everywhere. How many of you are there?

  • edited January 2015

    @muzza said:
    Otises everywhere. How many of you are there?

    As far as I know, there is only one Otis Scarecroe. ( plural, I believe, is " Oti " !)

    Muzza, we seem to frequent the same forums. I've seen you here and on the Softstep forum. Fractal Axe-fx as well? Looperlative ? Kurzweil? Electrix Repeater ?
    Adrenalinn 3 ? Bose?

    Catch you at the next best thing........... the ultimate piece of kit is always just around the corner.

    Respect, Otis

  • So the two posts above mine are from two different Otis's?

  • No, tis not so.
    For some reason, when i came back to the forum, I couldn't log on again.
    Started a new account and changed the name so the forum would accept me again.
    I was starting to take it personally, but worked it out ( with therapy).

    O

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